Social Question

ragingloli's avatar

Do you deem it prudent to fire your top vaccination official in the middle of the pandemic, for their efforts to vaccinate teenagers?

Asked by ragingloli (49024points) 2 months ago
21 responses
“Great Question” (4points)
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Answers

filmfann's avatar

I only had to read the word Tennessee to decide it was typical back woods hillbilly ignorance.

Nomore_lockout's avatar

Ditto @filmfann ‘Nuff said.

seawulf575's avatar

I actually read the article. I think there is a bit of politics involved, but it is probably office politics too. She unilaterally pushed the idea that the state should push to vaccinate minors without their parents’ permission. That didn’t play well with many in the public and was echoed by the state legislature. Having gone that far afield on her own, she brought her demise on herself.

I believe this is politics two ways. I think she was playing politics, using her position to try pushing an agenda that was not popular and I think those that pushed for her to be canned were playing politics partly as a punishment for holding an opposing view. Right or wrong, when you are in a position like that, you have to follow the chain of command, play the game, whatever. Or you face the consequences.

stanleybmanly's avatar

It’s the other way around. The lunacy drives the politics.

elbanditoroso's avatar

It pains me to say this, but @seawulf575 is close to right.

Tennessee has a large share of head-in-the-sand politicians – there are hundreds of examples over the years – but this woman – Dr. Fiscus – was far out of normal bounds by trying to go around parents and force vaccinations on kids.

Her message was a good one – kids should get vaccines – but her methodology was poor. If you’re in state government – not just Tennessee but everywhere, you have to understand the political ramifications of what you say.

It isn’t clear if she vetted her message through the governor, the secretary of state, or anyone who could give her cover. It looks like the answer is no, she didn’t.

So – she did this to herself by failing to understand the politics in her state.

It sucks for her, it sucks for the teenagers and parents that will die, but… politics is part of life. Like it or not.

Caravanfan's avatar

Meanwhile rates of disease and hospitalization are rising among unvaccinated.

Caravanfan's avatar

@seawulf575‘s comment seems reasonable on the surface but it appears it is incorrect. There is a top-down coordinated effort to tamp down on vaccination efforts.

https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/health/2021/07/13/tennessee-halts-all-vaccine-outreach-minors-not-just-covid-19/7928701002/

cheebdragon's avatar

According to WHO, she really shouldn’t be pushing for teens to be vaccinated yet anyway.

“Children and adolescents tend to have milder disease compared to adults, so unless they are part of a group at higher risk of severe COVID-19, it is less urgent to vaccinate them than older people, those with chronic health conditions and health workers.

More evidence is needed on the use of the different COVID-19 vaccines in children to be able to make general recommendations on vaccinating children against COVID-19.

WHO’s Strategic Advisory Group of Experts (SAGE) has concluded that the Pfizer/BionTech vaccine is suitable for use by people aged 12 years and above. Children aged between 12 and 15 who are at high risk may be offered this vaccine alongside other priority groups for vaccination. Vaccine trials for children are ongoing and WHO will update its recommendations when the evidence or epidemiological situation warrants a change in policy.” https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/covid-19-vaccines/advice

seawulf575's avatar

@Caravanfan The issue isn’t the vaccines. That seems to be the point where the views divide. It isn’t that they are anti-vax or anything like that. What they ARE against is trying to vaccinate minors without their parents’ consent. The entire teen outreach program Dr Fiscus was pushing was exactly that…to bypass the parents entirely. Maybe you aren’t a parent, but if someone did that to my kid I’d be up in arms.

stanleybmanly's avatar

I disagree that the issue here can be defined as an attempt to force vaccination on minors. It definitely smacks of allowing 16 year olds to decide for themselves regarding inoculation. Just as with other interests pitting the attitudes of parents against those conforming to the public good, the conflict is again about the fears and beliefs of parents vs. the hazards to the society at large. It is this woman’s job to vaccinate as many people as possible as quickly as possible. And while arguments can perhaps be made for insufficient data regarding the physiological suitability of 16 year olds in regards to the disease, there is little question on their ability to carry and transmit the virus, nor is there any debate regarding high school as the ideal feedlot for the propagation of infectious disease. I’m sorry for the people incapable of learning from history, but we should all be grateful that polio and smallpox were contagions of some 70 years back and not prevalent today. I can imagine this truly asinine controversy being waged over those 2 killers as well as the dozens of other horrors brought to heel through vaccination. I mean, just how bright do you have to be to simply glance at the past and draw the reasonable conclusions?

KNOWITALL's avatar

@stanleybmanly You should know going around parents to get to the kids doesn’t fly for conservative families. That lady should definately have known it would backfire.

stanleybmanly's avatar

I agree that it’s difficult to sympathize with her concerning her plight. It was deliberate career suicide in a state where the Scopes trial could be waged this very day without alteration. I wonder what will happen to her? Scopes was blackballed in Tennessee and had to flee the state to resume his career as a geologist. Perhaps greener pastures await our former chief of vaccinations outside the binle belt.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@stanleybmanly Exactly!
46% conservative state. That’s right up there with Alabama and Louisiana as far as the numbers by political ideology.

Caravanfan's avatar

@seawulf575 I am a parent, thank you very much. And I would have absolutely no problem with schools requiring vaccination for my child.

Tropical_Willie's avatar

It is not just the minor child may get COVID-19, mild to boot, but the non-vaccinated minor can give and give and give COVID-19 to others !

70% or more vaccinated and we can see decreases in cases and deaths.

99% of the deaths COVID-19 currently are unvaccinated people and they are dying faster once they get to the hospital.

lastexit's avatar

According to Tennessee law minors between the ages of 14 to 17 can receive medical attention without parental consent.

seawulf575's avatar

@Caravanfan Schools can require vaccines, but would you be okay with them just administering shots to your kids without your knowledge?

jca2's avatar

I’m not a Conservative, and I have no problem if my daughter’s school requires her to be vaccinated, but I would have a problem if they or anyone else gave her a vaccination without my consent.

If she had an emergency, like she was in an auto accident and needed medical attention, then of course I want it adminitsered and am ok without giving consent for it, but for a vaccine, I would like to have to consent to her having it. She’s 14.

Caravanfan's avatar

@seawulf575 If it’s a teenager, yes.

JLeslie's avatar

I feel bad for her that she was fired, but she should have known in Tennessee that was not going to go over well. I know a lot of people in Tennessee and almost all of them believe younger people don’t have to worry about covid, they think we rushed the vaccines to market, and they think the federal government will start forcing people to get vaccinated and is breaking HIPAA doing it and they compare it to Nazis, the last part is all over social media right now. As a side note the comparison to Nazis and paranoia is ridiculous and offensive in my opinion. Additionally, most of my friends in Tennessee are vaccinated, but they still agree with everything i said above.

My first thought when I heard the story was how will Republicans use this against Democrats. That’s how I always think when I see Democrats in the “news” spending days on a topic to try to make Republicans look bad along with social media full of people reposting outrage.

I found this article https://www.kff.org/policy-watch/covid-19-vaccination-and-parental-consent/ Basically, most blue states don’t even allow a minor to get vaccinated without parental consent, so I’m guessing Republicans will see the outrage as hypocrisy.

One thing I do take issue with is making it sound like it’s allowing a 14 year old to make adult decisions on their own. This is allowing a 14 year old to consent to something recommended by doctors and scientists. Although, I have to say even I think 14 is young to allow the decision.

Final note, Tennessee cases going up will not matter to most Tennesseans, they will only care about severe illness and death. If the government wants young people vaccinated they need to report on children in the hospital, and make it feel like that’s happening in larger numbers than it is.

JLeslie's avatar

One more thing. Her push might have wound up being counter productive. It looks like Tennessee might now not even do vaccinations at schools. I know where I live whole families were getting vaccinated together at vaccination events at the school where I live. It was convenient and not only got minors vaccinated, but also their 40 year old parents.

Florida also needs more younger people to get vaccinated, so it’s not some sort of shining star, but I do think the school vaccinations did help get a lot of young adults and children vaccinated. It creates a peer pressure situation, which has a positive effect in this case.

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