Is this question assuming that there is a god?

yes it is

Thank you. So, is this limiting the belief of a god to humans on Earth? And when you say “god”, is it limited to certain religions?

Im refering to all gods

Strange. If you think god exists why do you have to ask if he exists?

One of the many flaws of religion i guess

I still don’t understand what you are trying to ask. If god exists, it doesn’t matter if nobody believes in god. You already answer your question.

It doesn’t matter what people believe. The existence or non existence of God is not dependent of what people believe.

Its more of a philosophical question

I guess you mean it as a variant of the “if a trees falls in the forest…” question. ;)

Exactly!!!

The same as when a toddler closes their eyes and ears, to no(t) (longer) see and hear the spooky clown walking in the street, banging his cymbals.
For them they are no longer there, but he is.

@rebbel Are you saying belief or non belief in God is a matter of object permanence?

Believing in someone or something has no impact on whether they exist or not.

No. But even if everyone believed in him he still wouldn’t exist.

God is a woman.

@zenvelo I’m sorry, I’ve searched the word permanence, but I don’t get what you mean.
(Nothing to do with your sentence, more with my understanding of English).
I guess what I am saying is that it doesn’t matter if I believe in something or someone(‘s) existence; if they exist, they exist.
If they don’t, they don’t.
I’m more of a science person myself.

I’m not sure. Let’s ask Schrödinger’s cat.

Well he doesn’t exist. People make up stories to prove he does, though. But that doesn’t make him real, except in their minds.

Everyone believes in a God or simular being that created the universe.

They just call it different things like the following..
Wise men
Prophets
Collective Conscience
Spirit World
Angels
Aliens
Deity
Zeus
Apollo
Posidon
Greek Gods, Roman Gods and so on
By the way the lowercase god has a different menaing..
A god is a supreme being or deity, and it’s spelled with a lowercase g when you’re not referring to the God of Christian, Jewish, or Muslim tradition.

link to meaning of GOD
https://torontosun.com/opinion/columnists/hassan-yes-we-need-to-ban-the-burka-in-canada

Not everyone believes that, @Inspired_2write. I sure don’t believe in a spirit world of any kind. I belive physics accounts for the universe.

I’m with Dutch; I also believe psychics account for the universe.

@rebbel Object Permanence describes ability to know that objects continue to exist even though they can no longer be seen or heard.

There is no “God” or gods. Believing in him, her, or them doesn’t make any or all of them exist.

@zenvelo So you’re saying that “God” is an object?

Yes. Gods exist, if not in an “oh, look, that’s Apollo over there” as in Star Trek or stupid American Christian literalist way. It doesn’t matter if everyone stopped “believing” in them. They exist as conceptual and spiritual forms, at the very least.

@Zaku: They exist as a series of familiar myths that have persevered over time in the absence of or in spite of scientific development. The only difference is whether or not one believes the myths were/are true.

Is anyone else thinking about Tinkerbell?

@cookieman The myths being literally “true” is only an issue for people who misunderstand what gods and spiritual traditions were always actually about.

@Zaku: Which was what?

They explain stuff.

Tulpa. Not one I believe but anything is possible.

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GodsNeedPrayerBadly

@Inspired_2write I’m pretty sure I didn’t ask you to speak for me. “Everyone” doesn’t believe that. I don’t.

@blaine22 just think of all the beings that don’t exist and that nobody believes in. Probably more of those than the beings that don’t exist but that somebody does believe in. Those would include invisible friends that just one person believes in. Belief does not confer existence.

I get that you are trying to make a philosophical debate about whether something can exist if no one witness it, but the fact that you have to include your assumption that god exists defeats the purpose.

The original quote about the tree works because it doesn’t make the assumption that the tree falling actually happens right off the bat. And also from my experience, this quote is kind of outdated. From the tone of most people here we can conclude that the absence of witnesses doesn’t mean the absence of existence. I think a lot of people can agree with that. The quote only kind of becomes a good debate if you try to apply it to a specific situation like the existence of certain conspiracy theories or something like that.

That is why I’m so confused about this question. I actually thought you were trying to convert us into a certain kind of belief, and I’m sorry for that.

Just my two cents.

If there is a “witness” to God it’s just humans trying desperately to make a connection in their mind.

@Dutchess I’m not commenting on religion here because the OP seems to be trying to discuss a philosophy matter. So I’m talking about this purely on a philosophy and logical standpoint. Exactly what he wants ;)

@blaine22 just my two cents, but you should have stuck to the original tree quote. It makes the debate and your intention a lot clearer.

@Mimishu1995 I took it to mean, does an imaginary deity only exist so long as we believe in it?

Makes me think of a cheesy horror film I saw in the 80’s. Where this monster killed a bunch of kids and at the end they realize the only way to stop it was to stop believing in it.

Maybe it was an RL Stine book. Haha

Does God only exist in our collective imagination? The general “our”, since I personally don’t.

@raum The OP is trying to start to discussion about the “if a trees falls in the forest…” question, but with a god twist. Unfortunately he did that too awkwardly and it caused at least me a lot of confusion.

But yeah, I would use your example too if I was to discuss the original tree quote :)

@Mimishu1995 I think that debate is more poignant over the singular instance of a sound without witness. Versus debating the actual existence of the tree. A different type of comparison, I would think.

@raum Yeah I agree. It actually sounds much better.

Besides the fact that there isn’t just one supposed capital-T Tree. Any tree would do for the sake of the question. It doesn’t even have to exist. That is, you can consider the question without having any specific tree in mind.

@Zaku @Dutchess_III if I remember right, Joseph Campbell says they’re metaphors, ways of “packaging” the culture, its traditions and its wisdom about how to live, in order to pass it down from generation to generation.

God exists, regardless of if anyone believes.

@Dutchess_III: Well, exactly. Feels like @Zaku is being purposely obtuse to shore up this philosophical debate which is actually kind of thin.

Like @Mimishu said, if you have to insist that God is real for the question to work, then it’s not a balanced question.

Also @filmfann: I understand that you’re a believer and respect that, but stating that “god exists” as a definitive statement discounts all other participation in the question. I’m glad you believe that, but it’s still a belief.

@kneesox
“in regards to my statement that everyone believes in “a “God , no matter what form they chose to believe, that is all I was stating.

But, @Inspired_2write, neither I, nor kneesox, nor many others here believe in a God in any form. Literally do not believe.
We don’t believe in magic at all. Except maybe Chris Angel or David Copperfield.

(I know I got a Perfecto Fish for this one!)

@cookieman Myths, religion and spirituality are collected wisdom about life, the universe, and especially about the human condition and ways to live, to be, and relate to various aspects of life. They are expressed in metaphorical stories and characters to elegantly communicate their wisdom to people of many different perspectives, which is generally far more effective than trying to literally / pedantically explain or provide instructions to achieve enlightenment.

It may help many people in some ways to literalize mythic and religious stories, but it’s also a mistake of both literalist “believers” and atheist materialists, to think the point is literally to take the words literally, and/or to “believe” the literal information of them. The point is to read them, relate to them emotionally, and reflect and gain wisdom and enlightenment from the stories.

@Zaku It’s called “lore… 1. Archaic. Act of teaching, or that which is taught; hence, instruction; wisdom; counsel. 2. Knowledge; learning; often, the whole body of knowledge possessed by a people or class, or pertaining to a particular subject, esp. when such knowledge is regarded as of a traditional description.” -from Webster’s New Collegiate Dictionary, 1960 ed.

@kritiper What do you mean? Why are you listing a definition of the word “lore”?

Because what you described is called “lore.” It’s just that simple.

@Zaku: You clearly have a point of view based on your beliefs. That’s fine, but if you don’t acknowledge that not everyone shares those beliefs, you’re just waiving crystals around and stringing together words that sound important.

@Zaku I haven’t really been following this discussion, but I share your thoughts about both literalist believers and atheist materialists missing the point of religious texts and their meaning. I think both believers and non-believers get caught up in literal interpretations, making sure there are absolutely no inconsistencies (in the case of believers) and looking for any possible inconsistency to exploit (in the case of non-believers). Almost as if both accept the premise that if any one part of a religion isn’t literally true, then the whole thing is worthless.

@kritiper You’re wrong, but I give up trying to explain.

@cookieman How so? I’ve been not only acknowledging but directly saying that many people are stuck on overly literal readings, and/or “belief” issues.

@Demosthenes Yep.

@Desmosthenes @Zaku Great point! So many issues I try to discuss with other Christians ends with ‘but the bible says…..’ and that is their go-to excuse not to open their minds to any other ideas or interpretations.

Sodom and Gomorrah is one of the most frustrating. Using the bible, Quran, & Hadith as a source of perpetual anti-homosexual hate.

If there is no way of demonstrating the existence of god then there is no god. It is like asking if it is possible that absolutely undetectable atomic particles exist. Undetectable means they don’t exist.

If nobody believed in God then as far as humanity is concerned he/she/it would not exist.

Saying that it does not mean that God does not exist, it merely means that the human race does not believe in God’s existence.

I don’t dwell on my reasons for giving in up. I just know that atheisim answered all those questions I kept looking in the Bible for, and kept looking to other people for the answers. There were no answers.
Problem neatly solved.

At the end of the day, we’re better off in backing off, and allowing each person to have their own views on things spiritual. I have always held the view, still do, that the Jury is still out on the God issue, and always will be. So as long as people don’t trouble me about it, or pound a Bible in my face, then break a leg. Believe or disbelieve as you chose.

@Dutchess_III, yes, yes, yes, yes. “Literally do not believe.” And do not appreciate anyone saying I “must” in any fashion. (“Choose to believe” is it exactly. Believers choose to believe. I do not.)

I don’t even like to say I don’t believe in god, any god, because it implicitly acknowledges a thing not to believe in. There is no such thing.

How many invisible unicorns are in the room where you sit, you believer guys?

After I became an atheist I found myself in a church for a funeral. The pastor took advantage of all the new blood and gave a sermon fitting a Sunday morning. I hadn’t heard one in years.
I was floored at how many times he said “You must believe that blah blah blah.”
You must believe or he’s out of a job !

Hey, the guy probably needs a new Leer Jet, and one or two more new homes. He is only doing Gods work. @Dutchess_III

It was just a little ol’ Midwestern church.

Y’all can think I’m crazy simple minded or whatever you want but I do believe there is a God.
About four years ago I collapsed in the bathroom and I’m hit my head on the shower footer, everything was black for what seemed like a long time then I seen my grandfather standing in front of me, he’d been gone almost 60 years. I looked at him then I looked around and I couldn’t see anything else but him standing there, I asked where my grandmother was, He said she didn’t need to be there, I asked him why he said because she didn’t. And then he looks at me and tells me your wife’s wants you, I said what, he said your wife wants you, I told him I don’t understand he said your wife she wants you, So I looked down where he was looking and I seen my wife trying to crush my chest with her hands pushing down on it. Then I heard her words of endearment that most husbands here, you bad-$&@ wake the hell up, and I did.
A couple of days later I was told my father what happened and I told him with my grandfather was wearing and he told me that is impossible for me to know that, I asked him why, He said because that suit he was wearing what’s the one he bought at the tailor the day he died for his funeral and there’s no way I could’ve know what it look like because I never seen it.
So y’all can think I’m nuts or try to explain it in some intellectual psychological way but I know what I saw and I know what I believe.

No I don’t think you’re nuts. People can and do have experiences like that. Can’t explain it, won’t try. But I don’t doubt you.

No need to apologize either.

@BobM: Your experiences are your experiences. I would never assume you’re crazy or doubt you. Just don’t push your experiences as “truth” for all and we good.

I never push my religious beliefs on other people as long as they don’t try to push theirs on me you can pray to a beer can be an atheist and believe in nothing that’s up to you

I have faith in my abilities to reason, and that is enough for me to believe in.

Whatever keeps you sane and happy

It does, and does very nicely, thank you.