I don’t see why it is illegal in the first place.

People can’t help who they fall in love with right?

I say legalize it. I really hate the argument about it destroying traditional marriages. Because it is a stupid argument. If you think a gay couple getting married is going to destroy yours you have bigger problems to deal with.

Marriage being a function of the law should be what has people up in arms, not who wants to do it.

Legalize…with all due respect to those who think it goes against their religion, marriage stopped being a strictly religious ceremony long ago. Change is constant and I don’t see why the original definition can’t be changed to include same sex couples.

To expand on the excellent comment from sfgirl above..

Do people really want same sex marriage for religious reasons? They kinda tossed the LGBT community under the bus before there was an internal combustion engine.

Most of the people I know just want equal treatment under the law. Power of attorney, health care decisions, custody of any children.

You know, considering the state of straight marriage in America these days, I think there can be an argument made that legalizing gay marriage would possibly help the “traditional” marriage in America.

Yes, please.
Those against equal marriage rights should just evolve, already.
It used to make hossman sooooo mad when I’d say that.
Miss him. :(

Yes, I think gay marriage should be legalized. From the state’s point of view, marriage is just a special case of a contract between two people, and the state has no business telling me who I can and cannot enter into contracts with.

At the same time, if a church only wants to recognize traditional heterosexual marriages, they have that prerogative.

@Noon

I remember when the first gay divorce in Massachusetts happened. Oh, how they (right-wing blogs) loved to scream and pronounce that it could never work. Fucking Wankers.

While the majority of straight marriages end up in court. Hypocrites.

Wow, what an enlightened group.

If it is a matter of religion, then make “marriage” a religious ceremony and “civil ceremony” a legally recognized contract. Equal treatment under the law, indeed – the scenarios for gay partners and parents due to lack of legal recourse are frightening.

Issues of religion are so individual and personal that I think there is no way the government could (or should) be involved – it’s a private issue between an individual and his/her belief system.

I’ve never understood how gay marriage could possibly “threaten the sanctity of marriage” – if you truly are concerned about it, then make divorce illegal and adultery punishable by death. Yes, it’s a trite toss off, but it speaks to the hypocrisy of our culture.

I think its a fantastic thought. People can be so stubborn… We should have jumped on this bandwagon a long time ago… People in the position to make decisions like this just can’t get over their own stereotypical fears.

And note the state of marriage among most of our politicans. I am still struck by the tragic look on Mrs. Spitzer’s face during Eliot’s announcement yesterday. How many presidents since Taft, besides Truman and Carter (other than lusting in his heart) were faithful? GWB probably is since he wasted his libido over the years on booze.

legalize it, I can’t believe at this day in age, its still illegal. We need a change! Marriage is a beautiful sacrament that everyone should be able to take part in and experience.

I think of should be legal! Love is love and people should all be treated equally!!!

I am going to say do not legalize gay marriage, i might get negative comments but oh well. I for one believe that marriage is religious. God has made marriage for man and woman. To complete one another and to reproduce. And a Gay marriage cannot do that. I dont know why members of a certain sex are attracted to one another but by nature Man and Woman go together.

I know I told myself no more religious input… but I’m religious and I think God would just want us all to be happy. Eklamor, members of a certain sex are attracted to another just the same as straight ones. Since I was little, I’ve looked up to my Cousin and his boyfriend wayyy more than the next straight couple. There wonderful, and perfect for eachother, and should be able to have the same rights.

Yes God wants us to be happy, but no where in any scripture does God support homosexuality. There is happiness and tolerance. Then there is what God says, I for one am not one to question God’s ways just because someone says otherwise, Divine Being vs Man. Divine will win.

okay, Its your opinion and I respect it, its just that scripture stuff was written so long ago, I think we are ready for change.

Marriage is NOT religious… it is a legal contract between 2 adults. I was married by a court officiant, and I sued my ex for divorce. There is no reason why the government should limit it according to the genders of the adults in question.

It is up to the individual religious institutions whether or not they will perform wedding ceremonies for same-sex couples… that is a separate issue.

Marriage is religious, the orgins are and we as a people will our all knowing knowledge think we dont have religious roots. There is one church on the Earth that claims modern day revelation through a prophet of God. And God has yet to give any revelation contrary. No other church believes that, so no communciation with God would mean to should not alter what he has said. Why would the past be different than now. Dont the scriptures say God is the Same yesterday, today, and tomorrow?

@eklamor: Perhaps the origins of marriage were religious, but then again, the church and government were tied together in those days, as well… no?

This is 2008; over two centuries ago, the founders of the USA specifically chose to exclude religious organizations from setting public policy to avoid persecution of those who choose not to follow a different religion or none at all.

And again… I was married—not in a church, temple or mosque, but in the County Courthouse. I sued my husband for divorce because he was more committed to alcohol and drugs than he was to our son or our marriage, and that was settled in a County Courthouse. We attended church services during our marriage and separation, but we never had a church do anything that related to creating or ending our marriage.

marriage was first a contract then religion claimed it. It is a legal contract that exists on paper. What your church believes marriage is has no relation to how it is carried out by the government. The bible does not say “thou shalt file taxes jointly” or does it mention what to do with finances after you divorce. The government has decided that, and you obligate yourself contractually to that when you sign your marriage licence. The church has no say in that.

As for the bible, not supporting homosexual unions, I say you go back and read a bit more. My personal favorite Samuel 1:25–26 where Jonathan and king David profess their love for eachother.

There are several passages that support same sex unions, but you can google them on your own.

ah ya i must have forgot that loving someone is ok, as with David and Johnathan. Thats find to love your fellow brother but when homesexuality takes place God is un happy. Please see Sodom and gomorrah

eklamor, does that mean that as an atheist, I cannot marry??

@Eklamor: Thank you, sincerely, for your opinion and I hope no one on this board has tried to change or devalue it.

There’s a lot I would like to say, being an engaged gay man, but my fellow Flutherites have executed many of my shared concepts beautifully.

I will only say this:

Eklamor, you are absolutely right about marriage being religious, however “religion” is not created by God. Religion is created by man, therefore man is keeping my partner and I from getting married in our liberal state of California.

God is not religion, if you read the New Testament Jesus hates religion.

I do not look at something man made as sacred and certainly not exclusive. I fought tooth and nail for ten years to not be who I am. Finally, I got out of a religious framework ,created by man in order to enslave me in the law, living my life to the fullest with the man I love not forgetting that my walk with God is an individual choice and experience.

Thank you,

Daniel Riser

@eklamor
please go back and read samuel 1 . Jonathan and David do not say ” love ya bra” and pat eachother on the back. He says “my love for you surpases that of a woman.” later he also strips and kisses him, so umm yeah, doesn’t sound like your typical heterosexual locker room punch on the shoulder.

As for Sodom, umm where have you been with your biblical research. Theologins have debunked Sodom being about homosexuality ages ago. Unfortuntly the word “sodomy” still persists in our language, causing much confusion, but I would expect more from you. Ezekiel 16:48–50 lists the sins of Sodom, and homosexuality was not mentioned. Really you should try to read the bible for yourself and not the predigested filth found in most badly translated editions you find at the book store. The covers are really cool and modern, but their message is propaganda, not actual research.

@eklamor: the principal sin of Sodom and Gomorrah was inhospitality.

Consider this: when Jesus was alive, homosexuality was commonly practiced, among the Romans if not among the Jews. And yet, in all four Gospels, there is not one admonition about homosexuality. The only mention in the New Testament is in the letter to the Romans, where Paul condemns not homosexual love or homosexual acts themselves but temple prostitution.

Christ came to do away with purity codes and save all of us.

legalize. Who are we to put regulations on who we fall in love with. If there was a law that permitted me from marrying my husband I’d be crushed.

Ultimately, this question is a touchy one and my beliefs are in agreement with the majority of the responders herein——Legalize it and Love who you want. I’m positive that individuals like eklamor aren’t as open minded to the fact that homosexuality preferences cannot be changed or even ended. Race and gender are not optional lifestyles. They remain immutable and I intend to live my life with my partner and our kids in a happy, loving, HOLY matrimonial form until the day I am entered into my eternal life.

….Fucking Wankers….
Lighten up John Powell…..

And for the old joke…
Hell yes why shouldn’t they be as miserable as the rest of us….

I think it should be legalized.. The government has no place intelling us what our “moral values” should be. As for those who oppose it, well, theres enough of us who support it.. so in that case… Majority rules. Isn’t that what democracy is all about??

I don’t think it should be banned. It is how people want to live let them live it like that. Now, I personally think it should be kept to a minimum (sorry homosexuals). It’s just that I am Catholic and God did not intend for it to be this way. I am not gay but I know people who are and they aren’t mean.

@90s_kid
Could you explain “kept to a minimum”? “Ok, 10 of you can get married today, but sorry for the rest of you, we have to keep the gay marriages down to a minimum”. Like that?

It’s also not that god didn’t intend for it to be this way, it’s that what you have been told by the catholic church to believe to be what god had intended (and now possibly believe without the aid of the church). What you believe god intended may be mutually incompatible with what someone else believes god intended, and both have just as much merit.

@noon
it’s my opinion. And I know that some gays out there are not catholic like me, but it’s my opinion based on my beliefs. To your first question——I am not a fan, but I am letting them have gay marriage because it’s their life and the way they feel. I am personaly not for gay marriage, but I have another feeling that says “that’s what they want to do, so let them do it.”

<sitting here, poking a fork in my own eye>

sorry, I have a friend who’s gay and I’m supporting him. (I’m not gay)

@90’s Kid
“I’m not a fan, but I am letting them have gay marriage because it’s their life” And this is just horrific to think this way. To think that it should be someone’s right to LET someone have civil rights. I mean you actually said LET. That is so disturbing.

Noon, If you were a queer, you would NOT think that. You just have a strong opinion to ban it. I am no politician, but I just feel bad because if the world was homosexual and I was queer because I was dating a GIRL, I would not want to be FORCED to date a man or be kept single.

And by the way, yes. I know that the analogue I just used scared the crap out of everyone. It’s only thing I could think up ha ha.

Er, 90s_kid, you’re skating on really thin ice.

The fundamental issue here is that your religious beliefs should not put any restrictions on what I can do, so long as what I do doesn’t affect you. You don’t think God approves of homosexuality? Fine. Don’t get romantically involved with a man, and you’re all set. But don’t tell me that because you think God disapproves of homosexuality, that I can’t form a legal partnership with a man—or that “it should be kept to a minimum.” You can’t have it both ways.

Further, Noon is just repeating back at you what you said. If you think his opinion is inappropriate, well, you ought to take a look at your own views.

@90s_kid

I’m not really sure what you are trying to say, and why you are saying it to me. I guess I should have made my comment more clear.

You used the word ”let” and that disturbs me.

I am queer, I am married to a man (Yes my husband and I are one of the 18,000 couples that got legally married in California) I obviously have no problem with your thinking that gay people should be allowed to marry, what I do have a problem with is you thinking that it’s your right to LET people get married, that you have the power as the majority to dictate who can and can’t get married.

Excuse me for being Catholic :P

@syz: Hand me that fork.

<passes fork>

<makes like Oedipus>

@90s_kid
I’m sorry, I’m not going to excuse anyone because of their religion. You being catholic was a choice. My being gay was not (Even the catholic church has come out and said that it wasn’t a choice, hence the whole love the sinner, not the sin logic)

Your choice to be Catholic does not give you the automatic right to decide who can get married and who can’t. We don’t live in a Catholic country, we don’t live in a Catholic world, you have no special power because you are Catholic.

This is just like Hitler….only jewish

and I’ve learned that yes I better watch what I negatively say about homosexuals on fluther because theres a whole lot on fluther. I’m not following this question anymore.

I just don’t understand why the gay community has to abide by the heterosexual communities.
Why can’t both marriages exist? Why are they so threatened by the existence of gay marriage?

I really believe it’s unfair to deprive any person of the ability to choose whom they want to marry. we are all supposed to be equal and yet this country gets divided even more because of this issue.

But even so, whether the conservative people like it or not gay couples are going to continue to show their affection in public, and maintain relationships until people finally get the clue that their opinion isn’t going to stop them.

@ vanelokz

thank you for explaining what I was trying to explain lurvvveeee

Oh. My. God.

@90’s_Kid

So are there two different people writing under your account. Cuz, No, vanelokz was not supporting your opinion. Please reread your own posts.

@ 90’s kid : that isn’t what you were trying to explain, and if it was, you came about it the wrong way.

Make sure you read all my inputs. With the whole queer dating a girl analogue. etc. I guess i didn’t explain it good enough then because some (not all) of what you said matched what I was saying.

Aw, fuck. I accidentally lurved him. It was meant for you, mitch.

Thanks. <pulls fork from eye>

i’m down.

falling in love is not exactly a choice

Love is love.

I’d loved tp marry my gf if we could find where to go.